Pastor Says

[leo9]

contrary to what some people think, women cannot be forced into marriage.

That would be news to the special units in every police force in this country set up to protect young Asian women from forced marriages. And we're not talking about just the emotional force a family can bring to bear, we're talking about girls who know they will be hunted down and killed if they run away. Still, no pressure, right?

not even the mormons do that, as they give the girl the chance to leave the religion at any time (furthermore, they often force to leave for a period of time around 16 so she can decide what she truly wants for herself).

"You have a perfectly free choice, dear. You can do what God wants, or you can leave your home and your family and the one true Church and damn your soul to Hell forever. Up to you."

[Punish_her]

That would be news to the special units in every police force in this country set up to protect young Asian women from forced marriages. And we're not talking about just the emotional force a family can bring to bear, we're talking about girls who know they will be hunted down and killed if they run away. Still, no pressure, right?"

thats cmparing apples and oranges and i assumed that sex slavery via gunpoint, kidnap, and violence is obviously beyond the realm of a mormon girl becoming the second wife of a well off, affluent man

[thir]

"That would be news to the special units in every police force in this country set up to protect young Asian women from forced marriages. And we're not talking about just the emotional force a family can bring to bear, we're talking about girls who know they will be hunted down and killed if they run away. Still, no pressure, right?"

thats cmparing apples and oranges and i assumed that sex slavery via gunpoint, kidnap, and violence is obviously beyond the realm of a mormon girl becoming the second wife of a well off, affluent man

Why is that comparing oranges and apples? The topic was coercion, and a forced marriage is coercion, or at the extreme end of coercion. Also in DK there is a lot of trouble with forced marriages from cultures where the parents have traditionally arranged the marriages. The girls (they are usually quite young) run away, with the risk of either fending for themselves at an early age, or ending up a victim of an 'honour' killing. Also the boys end up in this situation, except they do not get killed, but they are likewise under a lot of presure. I have personal knowlegde of one such girl, who is still in hiding while trying to figure out how to get an education while avoid getting killed.
Many cannot handle that - they get married.

Why is a mormon girl always getting an affluent man? Does this mean that there are a lot of poorer men who never get married? In programs I have seen, a lot of the affluence came from a number of wifes working outside the family, and bringing their wages home, while the rest takes care of the home and children.

Anyway, if she is coerced, I do not see what affluence or not matter, but she could be wife no 6 or 7. How fun do you think it is for a girl of perhaps 15 to be married to a man 3 or 4 times her age? Do you think she gets enough attention, love, sex? Does any of them? Money isn't everything, and anyway in this day and age people can earn their own money.

[Punish_her]

"That would be news to the special units in every police force in this country set up to protect young Asian women from forced marriages. And we're not talking about just the emotional force a family can bring to bear, we're talking about girls who know they will be hunted down and killed if they run away. Still, no pressure, right?"



Why is that comparing oranges and apples? The topic was coercion, and a forced marriage is coercion, or at the extreme end of coercion. Also in DK there is a lot of trouble with forced marriages from cultures where the parents have traditionally arranged the marriages. The girls (they are usually quite young) run away, with the risk of either fending for themselves at an early age, or ending up a victim of an 'honour' killing. Also the boys end up in this situation, except they do not get killed, but they are likewise under a lot of presure. I have personal knowlegde of one such girl, who is still in hiding while trying to figure out how to get an education while avoid getting killed.
Many cannot handle that - they get married.

Why is a mormon girl always getting an affluent man? Does this mean that there are a lot of poorer men who never get married? In programs I have seen, a lot of the affluence came from a number of wifes working outside the family, and bringing their wages home, while the rest takes care of the home and children.

Anyway, if she is coerced, I do not see what affluence or not matter, but she could be wife no 6 or 7. How fun do you think it is for a girl of perhaps 15 to be married to a man 3 or 4 times her age? Do you think she gets enough attention, love, sex? Does any of them? Money isn't everything, and anyway in this day and age people can earn their own money.

jesus christ, in that case any marriage is coercion. what if the guy gets down on one knee and the girldoesnt want to hurt his feelings, coercion.
what if a girl gives the guy and ultimatum of marriage or seperation, coercion.
what if a guy wants to get a divorce but the girl will get most of his assets so he just lives in a shitty marriage, coercion

[thir]

jesus christ, in that case any marriage is coercion. what if the guy gets down on one knee and the girldoesnt want to hurt his feelings, coercion.

The decision is hers and not coercion - unless the family is threatening to kill her if she refuses. Coercion is a pressure from the outside.
Or are you suggesting that a person can coerce him- or herself??

what if a girl gives the guy and ultimatum of marriage or seperation, coercion.

?? I do not understand - marriage or seperation?

what if a guy wants to get a divorce but the girl will get most of his assets so he just lives in a shitty marriage, coercion

Then he himself decides beween comfort and freedom, doesn't he? Again, coercion by defintion comes from the outside, and from people.

However, if the wife had said: 'if you break this marrage, I will make sure you never see the children again' - that is a threat or attempting to coerce him to stay in the marriage.

[Punish_her]

The decision is hers and not coercion - unless the family is threatening to kill her if she refuses. Coercion is a pressure from the outside
Or are you suggesting that a person can coerce him- or herself??

someone else's expectations of you,from the outside

?? I do not understand - marriage or seperation?

what's not to get, tie the know or take a hike

Then he himself decides beween comfort and freedom, doesn't he? Again, coercion by defintion comes from the outside, and from people.

and she'll seize is assets because of court systems, from the outside