It's not about sex

[voxelectronica]

So i find myself almost constantly being questioned. Or at least a constant questioned look.

Here's the thing. I don't want to have sex. I don't want vanilla. I've had vanilla for 2 years and frankly I think I've reached a life time limit.

Now I'm not here looking for sex. I haven't met anyone from a bdsm dating site. I haven't so much as made a plan because the long and short of it is that at this moment I don't want to. I'm actually going through one of my "sex is icky" phases.

So the only thing that I can say to people as far as why they catch me on dirty, pervy, bdsm sites is "It's a lifestyle". Which they don't understand. Let's face it, bdsm is almost another culture. Any ideas on how to explain this... that it isn't just about sex?

It's like....

I can go to Japan and get great tea almost anywhere but I don't want tea so much as I want to participate in a tea ceremony. It isn't even about the tea as it is the culture. I'm afraid my audience wouldn't get that.

[Ozme52]

Nice analogy. I'm impressed (but not surprised.)


As far as ideas on how to explain it to your friends, if they don't understand that analogy, nothing I could suggest would do it any better.

[voxelectronica]

Damn you Oz! you have all the answers for everyone else but not me

I think even if you took away all the nude porn adds from this site people who looked over my shoulder would see BDSM and still think I'm after sex.

[thir]

I think even if you took away all the nude porn adds from this site people who looked over my shoulder would see BDSM and still think I'm after sex.

Speaking of which, I often find these pictures a great put-off - like a huge overdose! Anyone else tired of them?
And they are all women! Maybe it would be easier if some of them were men..

That aside, I do not find it weird that you want to stay with the culture. It is like - when you are in a foreign country you meet up with your country men and women - someone who share your background. Or if you were in a religious group, you would want to be with these people who understood you. Or if you had a chronic disease, you may want to be with others with the same, because they just know what you are talking about without a lot of explanations.

I do not find it odd, but people may because they do not know how much you have to explain when not with your 'own kind'.

[leah06]

Maybe they would, but perhaps not so graphically.

[fetishdj]

Why do you care what they think? If they persist in thier narrow minded view then that is their cross to bear not yours.

Unfortunately the sex is what most see and unless you are part of the scene you are not aware of the rest of it. There are even many in the scene who do not see BDSM as being about sex at all. However, unfortunately, the hook - the thing that dragged most of us into this site - is the sex. To my mind it is like taking an advert at face value and thinking that someone who buys a particular cereal spends every morning dancing with cartoon animals.

Personally, if you have tried to change their mind and failed then I would just let them get on with it and never mind what they think or say. You know the truth and what they think does not apply to you.

[DowntownAmber]

Elements of sexuality are deeply intertwined into nearly every human activity, whether it be a vanilla or a kinky pursuit. However, there is indeed a difference between something being about sex or being about having sex.

Dancing: very sexual, but it's certainly not having sex.

Fashion: elements of attraction and feminine or masculine identity, but we can and do dress "sexy" without the intent of having sex.

You get the point.

I have one partner in BDSM that I consider a sexual partner, i.e. one and only one that I would have actual intercourse with. I have other interactions within the BDSM community, however - LOTS of other interaction. To me it is a spiritual pursuit, a therapeutic pursuit, a meditative pursuit, a community pursuit, on and on and on...

I tell people that the power exchange helps me center myself, the pain is a tool of meditation. BDSM to me is the pursuit that provides the balance in my life that other people get from exercise or extreme sports or going to group counseling, whatever. It's ritualistic and soothing.

If they don't get it, well, they don't get it. *shrugs* At that point, not my issue.

[clipcrop]

You wrote:
“So the only thing that I can say to people as far as why they catch me on dirty, pervy, bdsm sites is "It's a lifestyle". Which they don't understand. Let's face it, bdsm is almost another culture. Any ideas on how to explain this... that it isn't just about sex?”

How does a small group of adherents of 1 religion explain their beliefs when living in a much larger population of a different religion?

Quote from Wikipedia:
“BDSM is often practiced within the context of a limited and defined encounter known as a BDSM scene. Such scenes often have ritualistic aspects, complete with modes of behavior, forms of address, codes of conduct, dress codes, and many other aspects of theater and role playing. As such encounters are often – but not always – at least partly sexual in nature, people outside of BDSM have a tendency to view it as a form of "kinky sex"”.

It seems to me as though what you’re asking for here is to somehow magically educate the mainstream population on BDSM. While highly laudable, I’m not sure this is an achievable goal. Those who understand BDSM, are implicitly in the lifestyle. Those who don’t, never will be. (I’m not saying wiki is correct, I’m saying wiki is correct about the common PERCEPTION of BDSM.)

You also wrote “do as I say and I will be your slave”. Do you really mean this literally? Or were you trying to say something along the lines of “understand me; and I will be your slave”.

[Flaming_Redhead]

You also wrote “do as I say and I will be your slave”. Do you really mean this literally? Or were you trying to say something along the lines of “understand me; and I will be your slave”.

It's a quote by the goblin king from the movie "Labyrinth."

Why do you care if they think you're looking at porn? Once you figure out why it's bothering you, then you can decide whether you want to explain anything to them or not. I've been trying to figure out why it bothered me when one of my friends asked me to pole dance at her husband's birthday party. It sounds exactly like something I'd do, but I was slightly offended that she asked me to do it. I'm going to refrain from giving her an answer until I figure it out.

[thir]

It seems to me as though what you’re asking for here is to somehow magically educate the mainstream population on BDSM. While highly laudable, I’m not sure this is an achievable goal. Those who understand BDSM, are implicitly in the lifestyle. Those who don’t, never will be. (I’m not saying wiki is correct, I’m saying wiki is correct about the common PERCEPTION of BDSM.)

No magic to it, just a good organisation and a lot of hard work. In Denmark we have had Smil for a sufficient number of years going out and giving talks, and it has had a very good effect. It also helps that the country is smaller - easier to cover.

But speaking of this country, the case with the head of Formula 1 Racing who was exposed in newspapers as having BDSM did in the end take the paper to court and won the case against them, on the grounds that what the paper had written was not 'in the public interest'. If bdsm had been considered abnormal or dangerous, this verdict would not have been given.

[Laila]

I agree with you - but it is also a lot to expect from people.

For example - My house-mates and I got drunk last weekend and very inebriatedly one of the males went on about what he had tried in the bedroom. and he mentioned something about bdsm etc. But he doesn't actually mean bdsm - he means kinky sex. Because to most people that is what bdsm is.

Now for myself it is very much about sex (lol its the novelty) but I do know the difference - it makes me feel so differently whether I am in the life-style with someone or whether I'm having kinky sex with someone. But I do think it would be difficult to explain to someone like my housemate.

[yourlilslave86]

I am now actively in the lifestyle and I haven't told any of my family what type of lifestyle I am in. It is really none of their business. Master doesn't hurt me in a way that would make me leave. Plus He has good aim and none except my collar are visible. I right now don't care what anyone thinks because it is the way I am if they don't like it fuck em.

[Pearlgem]

You're being sexy (which you just are, you can't help it), intelligent, interesting, knowledgeable and always a little bit groovy with fellow kinksters. Tell them that.

[voxelectronica]

Flaming thanks for getting the Labyrinth quote.

Since I happen to be more honest with you (as in the people of this board) than I am with those in my Vanilla life in general. Since it may help with this thread in general. Here it is.

My normal vanilla friends can simply understand that I'm into something "else". Something that they aren't into or don't know about or maybe don't want to know about and it's accepted that I'm the weird one. I don't mind that one bit.

I've recently moved. I moved in with an ex (to get me on my feet in my new place). Now this ex I've known for well over a decade and almost at this point half my entire life. Sure we had sex, that's almost like my form of hugging someone. Well now I don't want to have sex and I fear he's taking it personally.

I refuse (because I'm a bit of a bitch at times) to not go to websites like this. Though i do try to limit the times as I am using his computer and such... So from time to time of course he see's what I'm doing, reads over my shoulder casually, etc. I do not know how to properly justify going to bdsm sites and not having sex to him, because to him it looks like I'm searching for porn.

[clipcrop]

"I do not know how to properly justify going to bdsm sites and not having sex to him, because to him it looks like I'm searching for porn."

If its his house and his computer (or even his internet connection), I suppose he has the right to request that you not visit sites he doesn't approve of.

Demanding sex when you've said no is probably some form of sexual harassment, but if you need his place to stay at and you've been intimate in the past, I'm not sure what your options are other than force of personality.

[voxelectronica]

If its his house and his computer (or even his internet connection), I suppose he has the right to request that you not visit sites he doesn't approve of.

if you need his place to stay at and you've been intimate in the past, I'm not sure what your options are other than force of personality.

He hasn't requested that I don't visit sites. It's more... I've never had to hide anything about myself. I've never had to justify it either. Most people (for whatever reason) take me as I am.

The biggest thing is that I don't want to have sex. I had surgery on my no no bits about a year ago and since then have not really wanted to engage in sex especially not vanilla.

[TwistedTails]

The biggest thing is that I don't want to have sex. I had surgery on my no no bits about a year ago and since then have not really wanted to engage in sex especially not vanilla.

Perhaps it is time to call the Doctor for a follow up?

[Skyybird]

He hasn't requested that I don't visit sites. It's more... I've never had to hide anything about myself. I've never had to justify it either. Most people (for whatever reason) take me as I am.

The biggest thing is that I don't want to have sex. I had surgery on my no no bits about a year ago and since then have not really wanted to engage in sex especially not vanilla.

If it were me, I'd try telling him in simple terms, the truth. If he were friend enough to let you stay then he should be friend enough to accept that where he might go fishing for the weekend, you might like to go get your ass whipped until you cant sit down.

As far as no strings...if you have separate beds, then it means no strings. If you are however sharing a bed, thats kind of like saying light this cigarette but dont smoke it.

With regard to your 'no no' bits...I can put you in touch with some organisations who will help you deal with your anxiety. PM me if you would like some info.

[Diablo]

Tell him to be your friend and not a jackass. If you are only a piece of 'ass' to him find somewhere else to stay.

[fetishdj]

a) only access the sites when he is not in the room
b) use software to clean all your internet traces (cleandisk decurity is a good one)

And remember to seperately clean google search engine memory cache (if you have a google toolbar and you have used it to search for 'not at all porn but useful BDSM resources')

This way you should be able to avoid him seeing what you are accessing unless he is the sort of computer whiz some of my friends are who can undelete deleted things (but cleandisk mashes up the data good enough to prevent even more of them). Therefore you will not upset him over much.

Alternatively, if you have the cash, buy a laptop (they are actually very cheap these days) with a wireless adapter in it (assuming he has a wireless router, if not you will need a cable to connect it up) and do all your BDSM stuff on that. If it is wireless you can even do it in your bedroom alone where no one can see you (unless you invite them).

Just a couple of practical suggestions to your problem.

[DowntownAmber]

The site doesn't make this guy uncomfortable, per se, it just gives him a little bit of leverage in suggesting or assuming that the OP wants to hop in bed. And honestly, I can see how he is making that connection in his head: girl in my house that has slept with me before, girl has sex like other people hug, same girl is looking at websites that are stimulating to me when I see them over her shoulder, girl is not having sex with anyone else, clearly girl and I should be doing it!

Unless you say something vox, I'd be thining along the same lines as your roommate is right now. I don't think saying something to him means you have to educate the world on BDSM or even get into heavy philosophy to explain and justify yourself, I think it simply means you have a history with this dude and it's time to bring him up to speed on the present situation.

Tell him just what you told us: "I like kinky things, I like the conversations on this site and the friends I have here, and I'm on the site for reasons other than simple sex because, frankly, I'm not wanting to have it right now. After my surgery I'm simply not interested."

Leave it at that.

Or, then next time he looks over your shoulder, click on this thread, put it up on the screen and tell him he should read it.

[voxelectronica]

DowntownAmber has this completely right. The issue is that I can not get him to stop thinking "kinky sex"... he even asks now if we can have "kinky sex".

I'm a genderqueer switch who has lately been only about some very young (for me) very cute androgynous boys who act feminine. I've even EXPLAINED that. Genderqueer. Switch leaning Dom etc. These are not things he's into. He's into me in more submissive roles like i was in highschool, being super cutsie. So yes it's hard to imagine sex at all let alone the almost complete opposite of what i would want.

I am getting frustrated though and I'm thinking more and more that regardless of what i do this constant pressure is going to be there. It's frustrating. I think I'm going to have to have a "personal space bubble" conversation. As for some reason he thought it appropriate for no reason to grab and tweak my nipple. I'm a 27 year old woman. I don't recall the last time someone did that. I'm rather sure I punched them in the face.

I'm trying to be inclusive. I'm trying to be friendly and forgiving and understanding. He's a good guy. I just don't understand how to make him understand that i grew up a bit without making him feel like he did something. Everything seems to be personal to him.

I'm really sorry for the frustration in this. I guess I'm just a little upset with the entire situation at this point.

Side note... my no no bits are perfectly healthy.

[TwistedTails]

Well then yes, have the personal space talk with him, or a rolled up newspaper to the snout if he continues to act like a dog

[DowntownAmber]

J used to tell me all the time, "we teach people how to treat us, Amber." Your roommate simply hasn't had a lesson in awhile and is thinking of you as the same person he used to know.

Be consistent in your responses to his come ons, and speak your points without hesitation. When he makes a suggestion, say you are not interested and why. Many people hate to hurt other's feelings (especially when the "other" is our friend who is doing us a favor) and resort to overexplaining thus making our own argument seem less valid.

For example, if he offers to have kinky sex you say, "Look Phillip (I am calling him Phillip, for the sake of this argument), I'm flattered but I'm in a place in my life where sex simply isn't that important to me. The relationships I want to pursue in the future involve a much more submissive man, which I don't see you as." Pretty straight forward. Rinse and repeat.

On the other hand, you might be inspired to say something like this, "look Phillip (still calling him Phillip), I'm flattered but I'm in a place in my life where sex simply isn't that important to me. I've had this surgery, you see, and I haven't really been interested since. It's not you, I was really happy with our relationship when we were together, I'm just not feeling quite the same. The relationships I want to pursue in the future involve a much more submissive man, which I don't see you as. You were always more Dominant, and I'm really more Domme myself now even though I'm still a little bit of a switch." Not as straight forward... You maybe think you've made him feel better, but all you're really done is give him at least three different "ins" to keep pursuing.

"Maybe it's her surgery," he'll think. "Hey, she still fings me attractive and like the stuff we did together, just not right this very second but she never did technically say 'no.'"

See what I mean? Hopefully? Maybe?